Unformatted text preview: 2/7/12 transcript17.html Introduction to Ancient Greek Histor : Lec
N 6, 2007<< P ofe o Donald Kagan: F G P W .I' G , , , W E T ' , .S , Y S G .I I M G A , G G , .A . S , , P G P I G T
C:/Users/JIMMIN~1/AppData/Local/Temp/Rar$EX07.309/ /transcript17.html e 17 T an c ip G , A , .I , -' . F S W W , , W .A , ' A G , G , S P ' W .T ' .T P I .S , . , -, G G , E G I T ' .F . ,I , . ' , I T , O , C P W G , I W , .I G , W , G , .I .C ; ' I
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/transcript17.html ' , , ' -, , , I - ?T ' C:/Users/JIMMIN~1/AppData/Local/Temp/Rar$EX07.309/ 2/14 2/7/12 transcript17.html . W , . I' A ." S , A E , , ' , . N ,I ' T 431 B.C., , , P , , A T W .H ' .I .H , W , ' D S A I A A S W , S , P .W , S
C:/Users/JIMMIN~1/AppData/Local/Temp/Rar$EX07.309/ /transcript17.html , , "T , L , A A .E , I I S I' I' I ' .H W A G , E .T ' , , D L S , T A -S . ' ' ; ' ' ' .T , . , . I' E T T , , .B , I T ' , L , A , A , ' .I , . 465, , S epho , -, , S A T , T , 4,000 ' .S ,I .T A 3/14 2/7/12 transcript17.html the Athenians and it also led to a revolution internally in which the Cimonian regime was replaced by one led by more radical democrats like Ephialtes and Pericles, and also a diplomatic revolution in which the Athenians withdrew from the Greek League under Spartan leadership, and in which they made alliances first with Argos the great enemy of Sparta and then with the Thessalians whom they hoped would supply them with useful cavalry in case of a future war. So, that's a terrific takeoff point for the first quarrel of seriousness between the two sides which modern historians call the First Peloponnesian War. One other thing that happened at the conclusion of this previous period, that is to say, with the withdrawal of the Athenians from the scene, the Spartans finally took care of the helots. They never were able really to defeat them and get them down from their fort up on Mount Ithome, but they finally made a deal with the people up there saying, we will allow you to come down in safety and go away someplace so long as you leave the Peloponnesus. They undoubtedly expected that the helots would then be scattered one here, one there, one other place, where else would they go? That's what would have happened, had it not been that the Athenians, who had lately acquired, we know not how, control of a town on the north shore of the Corinthian Gulf called Naupactus. It has a very good harbor and it is so located as to be wonderful as a naval base for somebody who wished to be able to control access to the Corinthian Gulf. The Athenians took it and then turned it over to the helots who had fled the Peloponnesus. That was not what the Spartans had in mind, although there was nothing in the deal that prevented this from being done. But it means that the Athenians had done another bit of harm to the Spartans, putting their bitter enemies in a position to cause trouble to them and to their allies on the Corinthians Gulf. So, all of that suggests that on the next day, so to speak, after all of these changes had taken place, the world was very different and the prospects, I would have thought, for peace between Sparta and her allies and Athens and her allies had been badly reduced. There's no longer an association between the two. The Athenians had allied themselves with Spartan enemies; the Athenians had taken the halots and put them in this terrific place. This is not a recipe for good relations in the future--this is where the clich seems to me to be useful; people talk about a powder keg which only needs a spark to set it off into a great explosion. People use this about the outbreak of many wars. Sometimes it is an apt thing, and sometimes it is not. This time it is, as we shall see; it didn't take very much to produce an explosion between Athens and Sparta after these events. The spark was provided by a quarrel that took place between two Spartan allies in the Peloponnesus, Megara and Corinth, neighbors on that isthmus that leads into northern Greece and into Athens. Since they are both members of the Spartan alliance, the Spartans had choices to make about what has happening. And the choice was soon forced upon them, because when it was clear that the Corinthians were winning the argument, winning the war I should say, that they were fighting against Megara, the Megarians came to Sparta and asked for their help in putting down this war and ending it. The Spartans said, "no we are not interested; it is your business, not ours." Now, that is interesting. We cannot really tell, because there is nothing written about it, what obligations the Spartans had when two allies who are autonomous states, according to the theory, decide to fight each other. It looks to me, because nobody complained about it in terms of constitutional irregularity, that the Spartans had every right to ignore what was going on. We must assume, I suppose, that in the centuries or century or so before, the Spartans must have ignored other quarrels between allies and allowed them to fight it out or settle it any way they want. The Spartans don't give a damn, who wins between Corinth and Megara. And why should they get involved. I think that hands-off attitude must have been encouraged by the fact that they had just, probably were still recovering from the earthquake and the helot rebellion that came after it. They really didn't
C:/Users/JIMMIN~1/AppData/Local/Temp/Rar$EX07.309/ /transcript17.html 4/14 2/7/12 transcript17.html .S , N , G A A S .B ," ' ." N , 461 . .T ?I I , ,M , , P .T .T S , .I , . I .I .N P , , , ?T M , --M M , .I A S , A , S S , A A . A , .N .I , S , .I .W , A .A S --I .I , .
/transcript17.html 5/14 .T , , C , C W NATO ,A ." T X, U W " ' .T .A , R S , A , ?W ' .W S M M .M M G L M .N , ," " P A S , , S , I , S , .B .W .S , A S S .T , , , A . A C M C P , M , A , , S .T , , , A . .B , .A M , A M P T N , G , I -- A S A . C:/Users/JIMMIN~1/AppData/Local/Temp/Rar$EX07.309/ 2/7/12 transcript17.html O C , ;T A , T .I , ' --C G T , S .H -' , W .S , P , .W , M , A T . I ?I T ' , ; ' I . .E , ; .T .T E , A I , ' P , ' , F P , ' C , A .T C 431 A W A A ' W , " W , I ' ?" D , , -- ' P N , W . , . S A ' T . S ,I O H I W I '.S .S , I ' . , '.N P 457--I ' P .T E T A . E .E , A P .A ' .S , ' A .S , A , A ' N E , M , , ?T .T A .T ' , I .T .F P . N P , , S , A ' P A , ?W , , G ,G , ,G , --I .H , I , ' , .O .T T , , H . I'
/transcript17.html C:/Users/JIMMIN~1/AppData/Local/Temp/Rar$EX07.309/ 6/14 2/7/12 transcript17.html h bris W , ' 457. W A , , G A A S , .A , A A N F , A T T S G W .T A I D T B S S , .T , B G A C I , .Y S '
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7/14 11,000 C:/Users/JIMMIN~1/AppData/Local/Temp/Rar$EX07.309/ 2/7/12 transcript17.html -- ' B , 11,000 .B .S A .T .T , , ; S . .I S , P .T A G .T ' A , .T , S B , A ' , A , A A .S A A) B C , S A A A , A B , S S I' A A P .S , S ,A .I A , W ' P W
/transcript17.html I .T S . , , A P ; A A , S , O B .I C ' ; .T B .N , ' M .T C P , , .S , 2,000 , A ' . A
8/14 , B , A .I S , , W , U . , , .I I' .I .I ' , , , , ' ; , , .T . , ' .T , S A , , G , ' .I G A C:/Users/JIMMIN~1/AppData/Local/Temp/Rar$EX07.309/ 2/7/12 transcript17.html make a nego ia ed peace i h he Spa an ha ' oka in he o he gge ha he ' e j o of hei mind . Ma be he memo of ho i once a and ho i migh be again. Well, kno ha . The A henian ffe a e ible e e e ha begin a , and he n i do n, I hink Th c dide and a e, b he ha e ome hing he can foc on, a he god a e no going o p p i h hi ; o and I o nde mine hei i a ion. In Eg p he e i a e ible di a e ; he lo e. The Pe ian defea hem; he e' a g ea a g men abo ho man hip he lo e b ha e e i i he lo e a lo . The lo e a a egicall ignifican n mbe . The di a e i o g ea a o ca e a hole a h of ebellion in he Delian Leag e o he A henian Empi e, o ha e e o an o call i , and he A henian ill be occ pied i h ing o p do n he e ebellion fo ome ime. B he a , he p obable da e of hi defea i p obabl a o nd 455, beca e i ' in he follo ing ea , and hi da e i a good da e, 454-453 ha he A henian decide o mo e he ea of he leag e f om Delo o A hen , p on he Ac opoli in he back oom of he Pa henon hich he ill be b ilding e ho l . Ano he impo an poin abo ha i p o no all mone p in o he leag e ea a being ed fo ppo ing he na and o en ibl fo leag e p po e , all fo leag e p po e , b a e kno he A henian co ld al o e i fo hei o n p po e like he did a Tha o , b ill onl fo hip and men. No he A henian in i e a ne polic , and I hink ha e e o hink abo an hing befo e hi , hen he A henian do ha I'm abo o de c ibe, he el ha e made hi an empi e, no longe an hing like a ol n a confede ac , beca e he ake one i ie h of ha i p in o he ea e e ea a a dona ion o A hena, hich i ano he a of a ing o A hen . The a e no collec ing a p ofi , a a f om he leag e membe hich he , a e hall ee-- he e ill be an a g men abo ho hi mone i o be ed. The ill a g e i ' o mone ; e can e i an a e an o. So, o hing a e going on in o diffe en di ec ion and all he o ble ha he ha e in he leag e, i lead hem ho e e o change he cha ac e of he leag e in a e ignifican a . Well, hing a e o diffic l , he p oblem of figh ing he Spa an no i o e io ha he A henian ecall Cimon beca e he o ld like o make peace i h he Spa an and he kno Cimon i j he man o do i a no one el e can. So, he come back-- ell, I ho ld back p a econd. The e a ome alk abo Cimon coming back ea lie b he ce ainl come back in 451, beca e hi en ea of o aci m a e o e , and i ' no ha he nego ia e a fi e- ea ce i h he Spa an , i h he nde anding ha he p po e of he ce i o allo nego ia ion o go fo a d o b ing abo a long e m peace ag eemen be een he o. Cimon achie e ha and o ho o ho o aci m can o k he i immedia el elec ed gene al. I ' a ho gh he had ne e gone a a , and being Cimon he immedia el n o an ac i i ha ' a con in a ion of ha he did befo e he lef , namel , le ' go figh Pe ian . So, he ake a flee and ail o C p , pa of hich i in Pe ian hand , figh a ba le again he Pe ian , defea he Pe ian , b ha he bad fo ne o be killed. So, Cimon i no emo ed f om he cene in A hen . I hink hi i a ignifican hing, beca e i mean ha he onl indi id al poli ician, ho had he kind of ppo , he kind of cha i ma, he kind of backing ha co ld challenge he ne impo an leade in A hen , Pe icle , i gone. Thi help e plain h Pe icle ill a a ela i el o ng age i able o become a pe on of np eceden ed infl ence and po e in he A henian a e. I ' no ha he ake o him elf ne con i ional po e o ge mili a g a d o an hing. No hing change e cep ha he can co n on pe ading he a embl o do ha he an almo all he ime, and he e' nobod o he e fo he momen , ho look like he can challenge him. We hall ee ha ho l ha he ill mee an impo an challenge, b e'll come back o ha la e on. B le ' go on i h he o of he a . In 449, o ea af e he ce a nego ia ed, e find Spa a a acking he ci of Phoci , he poli of Phoci , again p in
C:/Users/JIMMIN~1/AppData/Local/Temp/Rar$EX07.309/ /transcript17.html 9/14 2/7/12 transcript17.html central Greece. They must have--again, we don't know how it was that they found their way up there, but they did find their way up there, and they took back control of the Delphic Oracle from the neighboring Phocians, who had--over the years they had frequently tried to gain control of the Delphic Oracle from the priest and it was on behalf of those priests that the Spartans fought. They defeated the Phocians and went home. Two years later in 447, the Athenians send an army up there. The Athenians are allied to Phocis and they once again take back the Delphic Oracle and give it over to the Phocians. These are signals that the truce is not really working. That the two sides are not finding a way to live together peacefully for the future, and sure enough, in the year 446 a series of events occurs that upsets the peace and the balance that the Greek world had found temporarily. First of all, there is an oligarchic rebellion throughout the cities of Boeotia and, of course, they drive out the pro-Athenian democratic regimes and suddenly Boeotia is a hostile place, no longer a friendly place, one from which the Athenians can expect trouble. There's a big argument in Athens as to what should we do. Pericles says, let's not do anything, we really can't afford to engage in ground campaigns against serious opponents. We tried it, but we can't keep Boeotia, we'll just have to let the Boeotians go. Against him was a general, an Athenian general--sometimes I'm astonished by the names that crop up in Athenian history. You wouldn't dare do it; you wouldn't invest names like this if you were writing a novel, because people would laugh. This guy's name is Tolmades; it comes from the Greek verb olmao which means to be bold, to be daring; that's what he is bold and daring. He marches an army into Boeotia to get the place back for the Athenians. In other words, he defeated Pericles on this issue, because he couldn't do that without getting the assembly's approval. But the Athenians must have been mad too and said, let's go beat those Boeotians up and force them back into our control. Tolmades runs into a terrific defeat, suffers extremely heavy casualties by anybody's standards and Boeotia is lost for good. The battle, by the way, in which Tolmades is killed in the Battle of Coronea. Athens is now driven from central Greece and that glorious picture I painted for you has been marred by a hostile force on the northern enemy. But that isn't all that's happened. Seeing that the Athenians were troubled, were weak, were vulnerable, and can be beaten, suddenly all of the unhappy folks that were around took advantage of the opportunity. On the island of Euboea to the east of Attica, there is a rebellion. This is really deadly even from Pericles point of view. He cannot permit rebellions in the empire on islands; it threatens the control of the sea. It's not just that he can't have Euboea be independent; he cannot let rebels in your empire succeed because it encourages other rebellions, and they've just been through that. They've had to fight their way through a whole rash of rebellions after the defeat in Egypt. So, Pericles personally takes an army and sends it, takes it, I should say, to Euboea and while he is gone with his army off in Euboea, remember with Boeotia now hostile, there is a rebellion in Megara. This alliance with Megara was always a very iffy thing. We should remember two things about the past. One is that Megara and Athens have been bitter enemies for centuries; so, the alliance was an unnatural one, the product of momentary agreement. But there would certainly have always been lots of Megarians, who were against it, and so seeing an opportunity these guys would have moved. And the other thing is that the Athenians were, of course, being distracted and their forces were sent off someplace else. So, now Pericles realizes how dangerous this is, because if Megara succeeds in the rebellion which it does, now they have no protection from a Spartan invasion which they need to expect and that is indeed what happens. Pericles, having put down the Euboean rebellion adequately, races back to Athens to meet the Peloponnesian army when it invades, and then we have this extraordinary event in the plains to the north of Attica. Spartans
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/transcript17.html P .I - , A A E .T , A .I 11/14 2/7/12 transcript17.html happening again. Fo in ance, hi a came abo beca e he all of one ide changed ide o he o he ; ha a fo bidden nde he ne ea . Somebod m ha e ho gh , eah igh , b ha if he e' a ne al a e ha an o go f om one ide o he o he , and ha if ha a e had a ignifican a egic impo ance, o ldn' ha e he peace a all o o ld i ? The concl ded i o ldn' , beca e he aid ne al e e f ee o join ei he ide. So, in o he o d , if a ne al joined one ide, nobod co ld a oka ha ' a ca e fo a beca e i a n' . Finall , he mo ema kable, and I belie e o iginal, ab ol el o iginal idea of i kind e e . I don' belie e he e' e e a ime in hi o ha e ha e a eco d of ch a hing being p e en . I'm alking abo a cla e in he ea , hich p o ided ha if in he f e he e e e an di ag eemen be een he o igna o ie , an complain ha he had again one ano he , he e m be bmi ed o an a bi a o fo a deci ion. Remembe , I'm no alking abo a media o ho a , "le ' alk i o e bo ." I'm alking abo an a bi a o ho ha he igh and e pon ibili o a , " o ' e igh ," " o ' e ong," o ome e ion of ch a hing. If ha cla e had been adhe ed o, i ' onl a ma e of logic ha a he e co ld ne e be a a be een he e o ide . I ' an ama ing idea, and I'm going o claim i h no p oof--I'll be doing hi again and again fo a hile, I hink hi i Pe icle ' idea. Beca e I mean e e hing ha I'm going o poin o ha ' o n al and nhea d of befo e Pe icle i in ol ed i h i , and I hink he j had ha kind of mind, e in en i e, ead o find ne a o mee old p oblem . I hink hi a hi no ion and I'm con inced i a hi de e mina ion ha hi o ld be he ca e ha in he f e he e o ld no be a e lemen of diffe ence b he h ea of a , b b a bi a ion ha help e plain he e de e mined po i ion he ill ake in 431. Thi i e impo an . I don' kno ho m ch he Spa an fel ha didn' , b he bo gh i . Tha ' he ea ; he p o i ion . Tha i he hi - ea peace and I i h Th c dide ha o ' e li ening in on. Tha ame. I, fo m o n p po e , ha e come p one hi belong in. a o kne abo ha a going o happen, ob io l he o ide ea o i and fo hi ea he m adhe e o he e hink e need o e al a e i o ge a hi a g men I'm engaged i , he e a e peace and he e a e peace . The ' e no all he i h I hink h ee ca ego ie of peace and an o gge hich The e i ch a hing a a--people ha e poken of he Fi Wo ld Wa he--I'm o he Peace of Ve aille a of en efe ed o b i c i ic a a P nic peace. The ' e alking abo he peace-- he hink he ' e alking abo he peace ha concl ded he econd P nic Wa i h Hannibal, b no; he ' e alking abo he hi d P nic Wa in hich he peace a he Ci of Ca hage a de o ed. The Ca haginian e e d i en a a , ho e ho e e no killed. The field e e plo ed p and al p in he f o , o he ho gh nobod co ld g o an hing he e again. Tha ' a P nic peace and he e' ome hing o be aid fo a P nic peace. Yo 'll ne e ha e a a again i h ha co n , beca e i doe n' e i an mo e. Tha ' one e eme. A he o he e eme i he e, I ppo e, he inning ide can impo e a ha h peace, b choo e o impo e a gen le peace in he hope ha in he f e he ill ha e f iendl ela ion i h he o he ide, and o he he o he ide, e en ho gh i ' no de o ed, o be good. The e a e ch e ample of ch hing . The ' e all a ca e he e he defea ed ide ha been o eakened ha i ' highl nlikel in he f e ha he ill be a p oblem. Then he e' a kind of a--le me back p a ep. Then he e' he kind of a peace ha people a a ep e en ed b he peace of We phalia in 1648 ha ended he Thi Yea Wa in E ope in hich a angemen a e made--nobod ha ac all been defea ed. The e i no clea -c inne ; he e a e no j plain lo e . E e bod ha fo gh o long and he co ha been o g ea ha he decided e can' hold o fo
C:/Users/JIMMIN~1/AppData/Local/Temp/Rar$EX07.309/ /transcript17.html 12/14 2/7/12 transcript17.html .W T P A F , .T 1914 ' I P F F , V , , .N I , ' , T .T ?I I' P , , G , , F , I F -L F .S . -.O , , 1870, G .B F -P , W F , A -L , , A ' ' .B . , G .T ?T , .S , W ; . S I' , I . .P .S , , .S , I' -, , , .I , W . -L , , , F , , F W W , T -; ' , T , ' ' ?W ,I , .P 431, I ,I , , , , , ' I ?N .T ' .T ' , . .B .N .T .Y .T .H ?T ' -- ' ' ; .H ?D S I' , C:/Users/JIMMIN~1/AppData/Local/Temp/Rar$EX07.309/ /transcript17.html 13/14 2/7/12 transcript17.html gain in f e a fa e, and I belie e ha he ha ha ' he no mal i a ion in Spa a. e e he no mal pa in Spa a, and hi i all deba able, b I hink To b eak he peace o need fo ha i a ion o be ndone b ome hing and e en , oppo ni ie , fea , chance o cceed ha e o fall in o place in a ce ain a o b eak ha . So, ha I'm elling o i , f om m poin of ie , i ' no a all clea ha he e need o be ano he a . Well, an bod ho a ha ha he obliga ion of e amining h did he a b eak o ? Wh did he peace fail? And ha ' ha I ill n o ne . I ill e amine he ea be een 445 and 431 in hich he peace i e ed o ee he he i eall had an iabili befo e i failed. We'll ha e a look a ha ne ime. [end of an c ip ] back o op C:/Users/JIMMIN~1/AppData/Local/Temp/Rar$EX07.309/ /transcript17.html 14/14 ...
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