And everything else on the style?
Then beauty of style and harmony and grace and good rhythm depend on
simplicity, - I mean the true simplicity of a rightly and nobly ordered
mind and character, not that other simplicity which is only an euphemi
And not only their education, but their habitations, and all that
belongs to them, should be such as will neither impair their virtue as
guardians, nor tempt them to prey upon the other citizens. Any man of
sense must acknowledge that.
Then let u
winter and the heat of summer.
I suppose that you mean houses, he replied.
Yes, I said; but they must be the houses of soldiers, and not of
What is the difference? he said.
That I will endeavour to explain, I replied. To keep watchdogs, who,
all circumstances a rhythmical and harmonious nature, such as will be
most serviceable to the individual and to the State. And he who at every
age, as boy and youth and in mature life, has come out of the trial
victorious and pure, shall be appointed a ru
probable, if it did.
How your words seem to hesitate on your lips!
You will not wonder, I replied, at my hesitation when you have heard.
Speak, he said, and fear not.
Well then, I will speak, although I really know not how to look you in
the face, or in w
parent will sometimes have a silver son, or a silver parent a golden
son. And God proclaims as a first principle to the rulers, and above all
else, that there is nothing which should so anxiously guard, or of which
they are to be such good guardians, as o
And the inharmonious is cowardly and boorish?
And, when a man allows music to play upon him and to pour into his soul
through the funnel of his ears those sweet and soft and melancholy airs
of which we were just now speaking, and his whole
I understand, he said, and you are quite right.
And you would also acknowledge that the enchanted are those who change
their minds either under the softer influence of pleasure, or the
sterner influence of fear?
Yes, he said; everything that deceives may
I will explain to you, I replied. A resolution may go out of a man's
mind either with his will or against his will; with his will when he
gets rid of a falsehood and learns better, against his will whenever he
is deprived of a truth.
I understand, he said
regulations appointed by us for guardians concerning their houses and
all other matters?
Yes, said Glaucon.
1. Odyssey, ix.
2. Iliad, xx.
3. Iliad, xxiii.
4. Odyssey, x.
5. Iliad, xvi.
6. Ibid., xxiii.
7. Odyssey, xxiv.
8. Iliad, xxiv.
9. Ibid., xviii.
14. Ibid., i.
15. Odyssey, xvii.
16. Iliad, iv.
17. Odyssey, iii.
18. Ibid., iv.
19. Ibid., i
20. Ibid., ix.
21. Ibid., xii.
22. Iliad, xiv.
23. Odyssey, viii.
24. Ibid., xx.
25. Iliad, ix.
26. Ibid., xxiv.
27. Cf. infra, x., para. 1.
28. Iliad, xxii.
And surely, said he, this is not a very severe order which we impose
And the other, said I, of which we were speaking before is lighter
still, - I mean the duty of degrading the offspring of the guardians
when inferior, and of elevating into th
30. Ibid., xxiii.
31. Ibid., xxii.
32. Ibid., xxiii.
33. The four notes of the tetrachord.
34. Cf. ii.
35. Iliad, iv.
36. Cf. Laws, ii.
Here Adeimantus interposed a question: How would you answer, Socrates,
said he, if a person were to say that
is a city, but many cities, as they say in the game. For indeed any
city, however small, is in fact divided into two, one the city of the
poor, the other of the rich; these are at war with one another; and in
either there are many smaller divisions, and y
at the one who first came up? And supposing he were to do this several
times under the heat of a scorching sun, might he not, being an expert,
overturn more than one stout personage?
Certainly, he said, there would be nothing wonderful in that.
And yet ri
Here, then, is a discovery of new evils, I said, against which the
guardians will have to watch, or they will creep into the city
Wealth, I said, and poverty; the one is the parent of luxury and
indolence, and the other of meanness
There seem to be two causes of the deterioration of the arts.
What are they?
Wealth, I said, and poverty.
How do they act?
The process is as follows: When a potter becomes rich, will he, think
you, any longer take the same pains with his art?
bid them till the ground as much as they like, and no more. Our potters
also might be allowed to repose on couches, and feast by the fireside,
passing round the winecup, while their wheel is conveniently at hand,
and working at pottery only as much as the
they would, take a journey of pleasure; they have no money to spend on a
mistress or any other luxurious fancy, which, as the world goes, is
thought to be happiness; and many other accusations of the same nature
might be added.
But, said he, let us suppos
be those who have most the character of guardians?
And to this end they ought to be wise and efficient, and to have a
special care of the State?
And a man will be most likely to care about that which he loves?
To be sure.
And he will be most li
And what happens? if he do nothing else, and holds no converse with
the Muses, does not even that intelligence which there may be in him,
having no taste of any sort of learning or enquiry or thought or
culture, grow feeble and dull and blind,
Most true, he said.
But when intemperance and disease multiply in a State, halls of justice
and medicine are always being opened; and the arts of the doctor and the
lawyer give themselves airs, finding how keen is the interest which not
only the slaves bu
And I can hardly be mistaken in saying that sweet sauces are nowhere
mentioned in Homer. In proscribing them, however, he is not singular;
all professional athletes are well aware that a man who is to be in good
condition should take nothing of the
Gymnastic as well as music should begin in early years; the training in
it should be careful and should continue through life. Now my belief is,
- and this is a matter upon which I should like to have your opinion in
confirmation of my own, but my own bel
prohibited from exhibiting the opposite forms of vice and intemperance
and meanness and indecency in sculpture and building and the other
creative arts; and is he who cannot conform to this rule of ours to be
prevented from practising his art in our State
I am afraid, I said, that a habit of body such as they have is but a
sleepy sort of thing, and rather perilous to health. Do you not observe
that these athletes sleep away their lives, and are liable to most
dangerous illnesses if they depart, in ever so
And the fairest is also the loveliest?
That may be assumed.
And the man who has the spirit of harmony will be most in love with the
loveliest; but he will not love him who is of an inharmonious soul?
That is true, he replied, if the deficiency be in his s
Quite true, he said.
Then no intemperance or madness should be allowed to approach true love?
Then mad or intemperate pleasure must never be allowed to come near the
lover and his beloved; neither of them can have any part in it if their
be trained in music and on the grounds which you mention.
Just as in learning to read, I said, we were satisfied when we knew the
letters of the alphabet, which are very few, in all their recurring
sizes and combinations; not slighting them as unimportant
Well, I said, and to require the help of medicine, not when a wound has
to be cured, or on occasion of an epidemic, but just because, by
indolence and a habit of life such as we have been describing, men fill
themselves with waters and winds, as if their